Wake Up With Marci

Today’s episode is going to challenge the narrative that we’ve all been sold about alcohol, especially for women and moms. That’s what we’re taught. And yeah, it was only when I quit that I realized how much alcohol had taken from me. It’s designed for us to want more and more and more of it until we need it. And it’s only been when we need it and we’re in a physical addiction that we’re expected to then stop. Which of course that is set up for failure, right? This is Suzanne Wary, author of the sober shift. Once caught in mommy wine culture, she broke free. As the founder of the sober mom life cafe, Suzanne is creating community conversation and real support for moms choosing a different path. Suzanne shows how choosing sobriety unlocks presence, purpose, and joy. the verbiage around alcohol use disorder and understanding that there is a large scope. Now, it’s the slow progress of change with a huge dose of compassion for yourself. And just remember that key to this is slow change. Yes. Right. First of all, it’s like all you know is chaos in your life, right? And then you feel some of that peace or clarity, it’s going to get really uncomfortable. Yes. And you’re going to want that chaos even though you say you don’t want it. It’s because that’s what you know.

Hello all and welcome back to Wake Up with Marcy. I am so grateful you are here. I’m your host Marcy Hopkins and this is the show where real conversations lead to radical healing and waking up to your worth. Today’s episode is going to challenge the narrative that we’ve all been sold about alcohol, especially for women and moms. My guest is Suzanne Warai, which I’m so excited to have you on, Suzanne. She is the author of The Sober Shift, creator of the Sober Mom Life podcast, and a true leader in redefining what it means to live a joyful, connected, alcohol-free life. And I want to ask you, if you’ve ever asked yourself these questions, do I really need to drink to relax, to fit in, or survive motherhood? Then this episode is for you. And I thought this was so important to talk about because I’ve been there. And so Suzanne, thank you so much for coming on the show and helping us through this. And we’re going to learn so much through your story and the work you’re doing. Thank you so much for having me. I’m so I’m so happy to be here.

So this mommy wine culture, right? You were a big part of that. You became an influencer around the mommy wine culture in other ways, but something changed for you. So can you share with us what brought you into that role first of all and then what shifted and changed for you? Yeah. So I think in order to understand it, you know, I I have to share a little bit about my story and my drinking. So I started I was a binge drinker in college and in my 20s and then when I got married in my early 30s and had my baby right after that, my first baby, I was like, “Okay, obviously, you know, the the party days are over. There’s no longer going to be binge drinking. And now I’m going to drink in a more orderly fashion like an adult. I’m going to class it up with red wine while I’m cooking dinner. Right. Like I’m I’m going to drink like an adult. A pretty glass. That makes sense. Yeah. Exactly. Like that’s Yeah, that’s different, right? And during that same time, I also became an influencer because I, you know, worked in fashion and I really wanted to connect with who I was before I became a mom. And so the two were kind of I was sharing my life and alcohol was a part of my life. I wasn’t drinking in the morning. I wasn’t hiding my drinking. I was in college and my 20s. I was a blackout drinker. That was no longer happening. like it really felt like I was like nailing this moderation thing. And so then I would share because mommy wine culture, this was this was in 2015, 2016, 2017 and mommy wine culture was really ramping up and moms were really told in no uncertain terms that alcohol was not only going to help make motherhood easier, but it was essential to survive motherhood. And I definitely fell into that, right? I I was sharing my life and I was influencing and that meant that I was sharing, you know, what wine I was drinking. I was partnering with wine brands. I was, you know, I even partnered with a vodka brand. It’s very clear now, you know, 10 years later when I look back, I’m like, “Oh my god.” Who needed more women and specifically moms to start drinking. And so then they created this botanical line of vodka because if you put flowers on the bottle then we’ll drink it, right? And so then I was hired to like make this look glamorous. Yeah. And that the crazy thing is that then I poured it down the drain because I didn’t I was never a vodka drinker. This was in the like wild wild west of influencing too when you know it was it was pretty loose like oh okay you’re going to pay me great. So, I I really tried to make motherhood and drinking work. And the thing is that I I did I wasn’t getting blackout around my kids. I didn’t I I went on to have two more babies. And but still, I hated it. I hated moderation. I hated the mental energy it took. I I hated even how I felt after two glasses of wine. I just hated it. And it wasn’t until my last hangover on January 19th, 2020. I had gone out to this fancy party with my husband, blacked out, which I hadn’t done in years, right? And I nursed my baby at some point in the night. Yeah. And I woke up and I was like, “Okay, that’s it.” Like, I’m done. I had no idea what that meant. I freaked out because I was like, how can I just be done? What is do I have to call myself an alcoholic and go to AA? I just didn’t know. Yeah. And then that began this kind of quest to see what alcohol was, how I had used it, and and to finally begin to tell the truth about it.

Let’s talk about the mental side of it. And because that’s so interesting to me because I felt like I was doing that. Meaning, yeah, the exhaustion around that was always making sure, okay, if I have two glasses of wine, it’s okay, but then if I have a third glass of wine, that doesn’t look really that good. And like, am I drinking more than other people are drinking? You know what I mean? Like that’s where it was for me. Like, and it was constant. What was it for you? Yeah, it’s that, you know, I I think it’s that for many women. I’m going to say most women. Yeah. And and we’re taught that that is just what we have to do, that we have to make our relationship with alcohol work. And the thing is it’s a highly addictive substance, right? And so in order to have it in our life on a consistent basis, that’s what it takes. We do have to have this um these calculations and these but they’re all silent. We’re all doing it but we’re not talking about it because we can’t talk about our relationship with alcohol. That’s left us feeling like we are the only ones who are doing these like calculations and this just mental draining energy and like all of this stuff that alcohol is taking. But we don’t know that there’s another way. I didn’t know that I could just kind of step out of that maddening loop. I thought I thought you had to qualify for sobriety. I thought that unless I was in active addiction or lost I don’t know what like what was I wait was I waiting to lose custody or get a DUI or like that’s what we’re taught. And yeah, it was only when I quit that I realized how much alcohol had taken from me in, you know, mental energy in my mental health, sleep, my ability to trust myself no matter what. But I didn’t even allow myself to go there until I was kind of on the other side of alcohol. Yeah.

So with you telling your story, so my just so you know at the end of mine, I did use alcohol my whole life from god knows how high school on to cope right with trauma and all those things. Then it was towards the end I drank every day. So drinking a couple glasses of wine a day was like, yeah, that was the norm for me until it started escalating and I got in front of the camera. All of my insecurities came up. I started using wine as liquid courage. Yeah. And so then that meant that I started drinking some at, you know, before auditions or maybe it was at lunch. And so it wasn’t just that dinnertime 5:00 pour where you start cooking dinner and do those things, right? Which by the way, so many of us women that we don’t talk about it, all we can think about is that five o’clock glass of wine we’re going to right all day long. But mine started turning into drinking maybe a bottle of wine a day, which I hear so many women out there like think that that’s normal, right? I know. I know. And then there’s what’s that slippery slope, which is what I was on. Yeah. Because it’s addictive, right? It is. And so it took me there. It took me to that DUI. Yeah. And thinking I’m going to lose my kids that turned my life around. Right. Like so I love what you’re saying though that it doesn’t have to get to that and that you don’t have to say I am an alcoholic which I love that we have now the the verbiage around alcohol use disorder and understanding that there is a large scope now right so where where did that take you so what did you end up doing to help yourself I mean is like what is there Exactly. And this was, you know, this was almost six years ago. And so there weren’t a lot of podcasts. There were some Quitllet books and that I kind of dove into. I exhausted the Quitlet written by women. I really wanted to hear women’s stories. In all of those stories though, it was kind of a more rock bottom situation. A more kind of forced upon you like obviously this is what you have lost. Obviously, this is what alcohol has taken. And mine, you know, my story isn’t this very overt thing that that I could point to, but it still felt like I had lost a lot to alcohol in nursing my baby in a blackout, right? Like that to me as a mom felt like enough. That’s a little bit of a rock bottom. Yeah, that would I mean we can be honest and admit like we as moms shouldn’t be nursing our kids in a blackout, you know, so that’s that for you could be qualified. Exactly. And that’s the thing is it’s for us, right? like we get to decide and and I think there has been just around the conversation around sobriety and around around drinking that it’s been this kind of user error thing where it’s like well obviously you know if you’re drinking a bottle of wine a night you’re just not doing it right instead of like no actually you’re doing it exactly right that is how it’s designed it’s designed for us to want more and more and more of it until we need it and It’s only been when we need it and we’re in a physical addiction that we’re expected to then stop, which of course that is set up for failure, right? That just doesn’t make any sense. You wouldn’t we don’t do that with any other drug. We’re not like, “Okay, just use cocaine in moderation, right? And like just a couple of bumps of cocaine at night is fine or meth, right? Like just just a little meth every night is fine.” No, that sounds insane. But alcohol is as addictive as these things. And it changes your brain the minute you have a drink. It’s a different brain. You’re dealing with a different brain than you are when you decided your moderation rules, right? When you decided like, I’m going to drink a glass of wine or a water in between each glass of wine. Yeah, you decide that with a clear brain. But the moment alcohol touches your brain, it’s it’s different. It’s a different brain. Not yet. Right. Yes. And so I just didn’t know any of this stuff. There was a lot of shame around my drinking, especially that last morning that I woke up with my hangover. And it was, you know, I think it’s very easy, especially as moms, to go into the what is wrong with me? How could I? Why can’t I? And I know for me, shame was the most corrosive thing to feel, but sobriety really requires us to kind of lock eyes with it and be like, “Okay, hold on. How is this a lie?” Because shame is a lie, right? Guilt is guilt nudges us toward the truth. Like now where I sit today, I feel guilty that I nursed my baby in a blackout. I regret it. Like I would change it. But I know that’s not me as a mom. I know there’s no shame. That’s not me. I talk to so many women if they get DUIs when their kids are in the car that it requires us to work through that and to say, “Hold on. This shame, this shame that can be very very loud, right?” And and that is a lie. What is it nudging you toward? Yeah. Like how can we cope better? How can we make better choices in sobriety? and really get to the root of what we need because moms need a lot. Moms need, especially since 2020 and everything we were tasked with, right? I still don’t think we have recovered from that as as moms. No, there’s been no ripple effect of that one. Yeah. Yeah. There’s there’s been no kind of like, hey, what did we all lose in that time? And what were moms tasked with? What did moms feel? You know, and moms need to be okay. We need moms to be okay. As a society, we we need moms to be okay. Our kids need us to be okay. And the reality is, if moms are being targeted now more than ever by big alcohol, which they are, moms are drinking more than ever and being addicted more than ever, moms aren’t okay. because I just kind of imagine and this is all the stuff that I that I kind of unpacked after I quit drinking and when I started to learn about when I read the quit lit and then just started really thinking about how I had used alcohol and how it affected me and then talking to other moms. I just imagine, you know, a mom from Iowa, like a mom of four from Iowa at 6 PM after like such a hard day of just relentless needing and no time for herself. She’s so tired and overwhelmed and touched out and just at the end of her rope and she’s leaning against her kitchen counter and she has needs. She has real needs. And I imagine these two like suited men and they’re wearing like sunglasses because of course like men in black or something, right? And that’s big alcohol. That’s big alcohol. And then they just like push this glass of red wine to her and they’re like sh Right. Like we don’t want Yeah. We don’t want to hear what you need. We don’t want to hear what you’re not getting. We don’t want to hear how if the system is failing you or your partner or whatever. We don’t want to hear it’s too much. Drink this. You will be quiet. And not only that, you will be numb and you will be addicted. And so that is what I see now. Anytime there’s a pink label on a wine bottle, right? It’s a pink label. That pink label is targeting us. And you know, I do consider it kind of a feminism issue. And I think it’s good to get a little fired up about it to say like, “Oh, yeah. Oh, you wanted us numb and quiet and addicted.” Yeah. We’re not going to do that because we’re going to figure out how we’re feeling and what we actually need as moms because we need to be okay. Yeah.

So, well, let’s talk about women navigating life, stress, social situations, parenting, not getting what they need. How do they not fall back on alcohol? What can they do? Yes. Oh, I love this question because this is, I think, the meat of it, right? This isn’t a kind of toxic positivity like, no, you could do anything. No, this is the hard work of change. And like you mentioned, you know, when did we start drinking? I started drinking I was 15. And when I ask my Instagram audience, I mean the majority is like 13 to 16 years old. 100%. Right? And so when we think about that, when we think about that through the lens of compassion for ourselves to say you are doing something for the first time in your life, you are feeling things. Yes, sure there’s joy. Maybe there’s a pink cloud, but you’re going to feel things that you don’t want to feel. and you’re going to be confronted with things that are going to be hard and frustrating and terrifying. Right? The thing that I always want to tell women is not only are you strong enough to feel uncomfortable, but that it won’t stay that way. It just won’t stay that way. Yeah. You know, alcohol, we we always hear addiction is progressive and yes, it is. But sobriety is also progressive. There is there’s a progression when you learn how how to feel. When you learn how to feel, you know, and this is what I talk about in the book, and I really do like hold your hand through this process because it’s not all all easy. It’s not all good. You know, I think there’s a there’s a kind of mourning process that we go through at first. I know I did of like, okay, and it it’s a grief of what I had always thought alcohol could be. I thought it would be fasttracked to connection and I thought it would help me belong and have fun. And it’s like a breakup with a toxic ex. There’s some grief that goes in there and I think we have to allow ourselves to feel that. And you know, community helps so much with this. Yes. And and being around women who that’s why I created I have the sober mom life cafe. Being around women who have been where you are and can kind of tell you about what’s to come, right? Yeah. I always say you’re probably we have peer support meetings and and I’m always like you’re probably going to sit in the meetings for a while and say I don’t believe you. I don’t believe you but I’m going to come back. Right. I’m going to It’s this leap of faith that I think sobriety requires of like, okay, I gave alcohol. How many chances have we given alcohol? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, a lot, right? Yeah. Yeah. It’s It’s not going to change. No. But but we can we are capable of great change, right? And so we are. Yes. Yeah. The more that we take the steps through that healing journey, the easier it gets. Yes. Just like us drinking and pushing it down, right? Just like navigating life on autopilot and trying to be there for everyone else. It’s a new way. So, you’re having to really retrain and rewire your brain. You know, women like us that are sober that are trying to help others because we’ve gone through it and we understand. Yeah, it was easier to just grab the glass of wine, 100%. What wasn’t easier was the fallout from each time you did that and and to feel the way that you felt. So then when you put it down and you start finding these other ways to navigate life in a more positive way, it sucks at first. It’s hard. There’s no doubt about it, you know? It is. Yeah. I always call it like Yeah. It’s like mold in the basement, right? when when we’re drinking and think about all of the stuff that has happened to us in our lives and if we drink through it, we just push it down, push it down. It doesn’t go away, right? It’s just mold in the basement. We push it down and it starts to fester. And sobriety is, you know, slowly and it’s not all at first, but slowly you are you are shining a light like let’s get let’s look in that corner like what’s over there and then it brings up facing it, right? When you start facing it, you understand healthy ways to face it. Yeah. It’s like the the miracles are amazing. They really really are. I’m just now 10 years sober, which we don’t have to count, but you know, we’ve got a lot of years, you know, between us. And so, you’ve got your toolbox that that you build and and then those the gratitude, the morning practices, what you do, right? What happens with your brain? There’s so much. But if you really start to join groups like yours or even if you’re not ready, like maybe you’re just thinking about it, you can just right. Oh, feeling it out. Yes. I love talking to women who are still drinking but are drinking with the blinders off. there’s such a difference, you know, because I think specifically that group can get really hard on themselves and they want to quit, but they kind of fall back into old patterns. And I think the key the key in to that whole kind of moment where you’re where you’re just kind of teeter tottering, you have one foot in, one foot out. The secret to that is compassion for yourself, which feels very foreign, right? Which feels like because I just want to quit drinking, but I just keep falling, you know, into old patterns. And and that’s where that shame can come in and we can start to say, “What? What’s wrong with me? Why can’t I?” Right? And then shame is so hard to feel that we can then continue to drink instead of shaming ourselves. We’ve tried that. Doesn’t work. Keeps us stuck. So what if now it’s compassion to say oh of oh look you know yeah you did you were stressed you reached for something you’ve been reaching for for decades and now today we’re going to do it differently today we’re going to check in we’re going to share what we learned what we you know might have needed instead. So it is this like it’s this slow progress of change with a huge dose of compassion for yourself. And just remember that key to this is slow change. Yes. Right. I mean first of all it’s like all you know is chaos in your life, right? And then you feel some of that peace or clarity. It’s going to get really uncomfortable. Yes. And you’re going to want that chaos even though you say you don’t want it. It’s because that’s what you know. And it’s so true. And I hear so many women say like, “Well, I’m bored in sobriety.” And I’m like, “Yes, yes.” Curious. And here’s the thing that, you know, I liken it to. So, my kids are 11, eight, and six. And when they come up to me and say, “I’m bored.” I’m always like, “Great, great.” Because you know what? You know what happens when you’re bored? You are so creative. Every good thing starts with being bored and being like, “What do I what do I do?” You probably don’t know how you like to spend your time. If you’ve been drinking your whole adult life, Yes. You don’t know. Like I I fell in love with puzzles and sobriety. I love you guys. I know it might sound It might sound Yeah. I love puzzles so much because I can’t, you know, my mind doesn’t wander. It’s very like I’m concentrated. It’s so soothing to me. It’s just I I’m using my brain in a different way. I love puzzles. I love running and yoga and all of those things, but puzzles is something that I would not have thought, you know, if you told me 10 years ago I would spend a day doing a puzzle, I would have called myself a dork, you know. Yeah. Exactly. I mean, and even like adult coloring books are so fun just, right? Like it’s so cool. I remember my first vacation, I’m sober, and we go on this hike, right? And I must have asked the guide 50 million questions as we’re walking. Whereas before, I would have been doing the hike looking around. Okay. Is it Are we going to get back? Is it time? Yes. So we can get, you know, get the glass of wine. And it was so fulfilling. And isn’t that interesting because I don’t think at least I didn’t realize how much I thought about alcohol until it was gone. And so you wouldn’t have thought like you’re like, “Well, I wasn’t drinking on that hike.” No, but you invited alcohol into it, right? By thinking about it, by counting down to it, by wishing it was. Yes. And so when alcohol it it just takes up the oxygen in the entire room when it’s in your life. Oh, so much space. We’re both our head is in our hands. We’re like, “Oh god.” Yes.

So, tell me what a couple of things. Yeah. So, first, let’s start off. If somebody is looking, thinking, and looking because they’re curious about, you know, I think I’m drinking too much. I’d like to maybe try to stop. I don’t necessarily want to go to the 12step program. What do you recommend? I think the number one thing is to find community. Just give as much air time to sobriety as you do to drinking, right? And and that can be with with quit lit with what you’re listening to by the sober shift. I narrate it myself. So have that in your ear, but also just kind of take take a little baby step into a sober community. Find online. I mean, it’s it’s pretty easy now that everything is online. You can have your camera on, your camera off. You don’t have to talk. You don’t just listen in at first. Just start to connect with people who share the bright side of sobriety. Start to just open that door a little bit because if you’ve always been around drinkers, if you’ve always been a drinker, you need to see the other side. You need to because you don’t know another way. So, yeah. Yes. And nowadays, social media is huge. There’s a huge influence there. Yeah. And like you said, podcast like yours and and mine. You know, a lot of what I talk about is soiety and recovery and what that looks like. And then the groups and even if you do feel that you need the 12step program, there are meetings now since COVID online. Yeah. where you don’t have to to turn on your camera and until you’re ready. Until you’re ready. I I always believe in sharing because that really gets you involved, but it takes a while. Yeah.

So, tell us about your group. Yeah. So, my group is called the Sober Mom Life Cafe. And, you know, I created it because we I know I just felt so alone in my drinking, in my moderation stuff. we we don’t talk about it. And I wanted a place I could just like turn my light on, right? And then women could just come and and start to hear women telling the truth about alcohol without shame, without judgment. We don’t use the label alcoholic. Just, you know, that’s just how Yeah, that’s Yeah, it just didn’t feel right. And so what we do, my mom is a part of it. She’s a therapist. She quit drinking when she was 69. Um, which I think I know. Isn’t that amazing? And so we have peer support meetings five days a week and that’s really just coming on and talking. Sometimes we’re not talking about alcohol so much of the time. We’re not talking about how not to drink. Sometimes we are. You know, if someone has a vacation coming up, okay, let’s talk let’s talk you through it. But a lot of times we’re talking about life. We’re talking about, okay, I quit drinking. I love it. My husband is still drinking. And every time I hear him open a beer on Sunday afternoon, my skin crawls, right? And so then women just we start sharing our stories. We we start sharing what we’ve been through. It’s just I mean, it’s I host a meeting every Friday at 10:00 a.m. Central. And it’s like the highlight of my week is being able to connect with these ladies. We need each other, especially as moms, right? Moms, I think, are so We’re never alone, but we’re very lonely. And we need each other. And so, this is just a So true. Thank you. I want I want you to say that again. We’re never alone, but we’re so lonely. Yes. Yes. And it Yeah, it that’s definitely how I felt, especially after that first baby, you know, the second if you’re in that b Oh, it’s just such a lonely thing. and but you’re yeah you’re never alone. You’re touched out. And so just to be able to connect, we have book club once a month. We have yeah a private Facebook group where you you just get to post on there at any hour of the day and get support. We have retreats. How do you Yeah. So how do you how do you submit your book if you want to be part of the book club? Yes. Oh my gosh. You You’re in. You’re in. Let’s do it. You do? Yes. Let’s do it. Yes. Good. We we’ll we’ll have you on for sure. Yeah. It’s the best. You have retreats which are amazing. These intimate settings and these beautiful places and just a great way to really connect. Yeah. It’s wrapped in, you know, luxury, but there’s real work that happens. My mom and I host sessions. We’re going to Mexico. We have a few spots open still. We’re going to Mexico in February. At the end of February. Yeah. Yeah. And so then there’s actual Yeah. work like setting boundaries and people pleasing and all of the stuff that comes up in sobriety and we hope you work through it. So amazing and your book, The Sober Shift, and just thank you for all that you do. I mean, truly helping these women to navigate this. It’s it’s a hard one, but I’m so grateful that we can do the work that we’re doing today. Yes. Oh, me too. It’s It’s I could talk about it forever and I do. I know. I do. I know. Yeah. Thank you. It’s just I love what you said. We don’t have to hit our rock bottom, but if someone’s out there struggling, what’s what’s one thing you’d like to say to them? You’re not alone. You’re not alone. I would say connect with one person. Tell one person how you’re feeling because I think when we feel alone, when we’re in our head, that’s when that shame comes in and how we talk to ourselves. And I want you to know you are not alone and it gets so much better. Yeah, it does. Thank you so much for being on the show and for everyone out there joining us. Please be sure to subscribe, leave a review, and share this episode with someone who needs to hear it. a mom, a woman out there in your life that needs to hear this. And remember this, you don’t need a breakdown to choose a breakthrough. You are worthy. You are enough. And it’s never too late to rewrite your story. So, I will see you guys next week. There’s a new episode every Thursday. So, please join us on YouTube, your favorite podcast platform, and also on OnJ streaming network that’s available on Apple TV and Roku. Wishing you all an amazing week, and I’ll see you next time.